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Hello and welcome to another episode of the Poultry Keepers Podcast.
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In this episode Jeff Mattocks and Carey Blackmon explain how you can help prevent heat stress in your birds so they can beat the heat this summer.
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This is the audio recording of a recent Poultry Keepers 360 Livestream.
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Now here's Jeff and Carey.
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You're if I tell you the truth, I'm dragging butt, I'm still trying to figure out how to sleep on a US schedule again, but it's okay.
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It's all right.
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Okay, good.
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It's getting better.
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Every day.
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Takes about 10 days, two weeks.
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Good evening everyone.
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Rick's unable to make, to meet with us tonight.
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He has, he's taking care of Mary.
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She is doing to be expected and things are going as they should.
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Doctors aren't getting them information as fast as they would like, but aside from that, things are going.
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We did check in with him and talk about her earlier today, so just wanted to get that out of the way.
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Settle your nerves.
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Tonight we are gonna talk about beating the heat.
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Obviously, unless you're one of our friends, like we talked to the other week that's up in Canada, who's still having some really awkwardly hot temperatures, it's hot everywhere.
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I talked to a friend of mine in I, Indiana.
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Yeah.
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Indiana, earlier day, and it was like 95.
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So it is hot everywhere.
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So tonight we're gonna talk about beating the heat.
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Proven ways to prevent heat stress in your birds.
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How's that sound, Joe?
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Sounds good to me.
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So we're gonna start with the basics.
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And chickens, they don't sweat like people do.
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Internal temperature averages from 104 to 107, so they're already hotter.
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One of the reasons why they stay warmer in the wintertime than we actually think they do.
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They're already hotter in the summertime.
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So with that, we don't want them to get hotter.
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They're gonna be flaring their wings, they're gonna be doing all that kind of stuff.
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They're gonna pant, I, we're all human.
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I, the other day, a week and a half ago, I was outside for a couple hours, drank half a gallon of water.
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I'm still paying.
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Jeff how do you think would be some good ways to first let, how would you define heat stress?
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What would you say the scientific definition of heat stress is?
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Geez, I don't know.
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Nobody's ever farm that question.
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Yeah.
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I.
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Pretty much when you have when your day night temperatures like, and I explained this to a guy earlier today, right?
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You take your daytime, your nighttime low, your daytime high, you add the two together, right?
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And you divide by two and.
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I'm looking at your 24 hour ambient temperature, right?
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Yep.
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If you're a hundred during the day and you're 80 at night, that's 180, you're at 90 degree average.
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You need to do something at 90 degree average.
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I should slow down.
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Not everyone does math.
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The same as I do.
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Yeah.
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But we have learned that a lot lately.
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Okay.
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Anyway, sorry.
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Pretty much when you're 80 plus, 85 plus, we need to start looking for ways to make the birds a little bit more comfortable.
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And we've talked about it a lot over the years on the show, individually with people in the groups, there's a lot of things you can do.
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Okay.
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I can run right down through the checklist if you like, but number one is shade.
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Two, you try and orient your pens or whatever's holding your birds to capture as much natural airflow as there can be.
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And I realize there's days here coming up in August, right?
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The air don't move and it just, sits there and bakes you.
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So shade, capture as much airflow as you can.
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You can even consider getting some of the big livestock fans, they make four foot fans, right?
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So if your birds are in a housed area, right?
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You don't have'em out on runs where they can get shade and.
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Fresh air or moving air you gotta invest in fans.
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And nowadays you can do fans with misters, right?
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You can put little Mister Kits on the front of those fans and it's not, it ain't rocket science.
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And you can, you can move almost like a homemade swamp cooler.
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So
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look, so last year when we talked about that.
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I got the idea.
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I looked on Amazon, which is one of my favorite places to look for stuff because I don't have any, I don't have a gardening shop, gardening supply house local to me.
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So I got one of the kits, a pressure reducer to drop your hose pipe pressure down to 25 pounds, and I think it had 200 feet of quarter inch tube in it.
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A bunch of tees.
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And little Mr.
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Nozzle to go on the other part of the tee.
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And what I did was I ran part of it through my fence area and then I just started running it through my breeder pins up towards the top.
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And once I got it in place, throughout everything, which took most of the 200 feet I just went back and zip tied on the wire.
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The hose to keep it in place.
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And then I cut a notch, put my key in there with the connections and my birds.
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I put the garden hose thing on a timer to have it come on from 11 to one 30 in the afternoon.
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And they're,
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yeah.
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The first time, first and second time they come on, the birds freak out about it.
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'cause it's new.
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Yep.
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And it's different.
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They did.
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And after about three days they figure out, this feels really good.
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And, they're in, they're all in.
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Not a problem.
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And I'll also say this in August, like you're talking about earlier, with no wind.
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When the true dog days of summer typically it's also very dry and I didn't like my bird's feathers.
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Had more sheen to'em than they had any other summer.
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And I attribute that to the the misters like it, it worked out really well.
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And a lot of my pins also have a 12 inch fan in the top that blows air down and it just blows straight down.
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But it keeps air moving even when the wind's not So that.
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They really like that.
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You now, your sheen also, you've, over the last couple years, you've been constantly like tweaking and improving your feed formula.
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So they're, I'm not saying that the MRS helped and keeping'em comfortable helped and the summer will dry out feathers.
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That's a hundred percent true.
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With the corrections you've made to the feed by getting the fat levels right.
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Getting the amino acids and then the proteins and everything else where they need to be.
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You're enabling the bird to maintain that healthier look longer.
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Yeah.
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And that also helped.
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I am not gonna say that eliminated the heat stress.
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No, by no means, but it definitely made it better, I feel like, with the fans and the water.
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Oh yeah,
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absolutely.
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And trying to figure out and not everybody can do this, right?
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You can do this, some people can do this.
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But when you get a feed formula where you can reduce the corn and you have that higher fat level.
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You're getting your energy, you're getting more energy from fat, which re, which has the least amount of body heat increase during digestion.
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And so imagine this, but corn has 1500 calories per pound.
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Fat has like cooking oil and dietary fat has 4,000.
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So it's a two and a half to one offset.
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So for every two and a half pounds of fat added to the diet.
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Or for every one pound of fat I can replace two and a half pounds of corn.
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'cause when starch and carbohydrates digest, and we know this, right?
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You go eat a high starchy diet in the middle of August and eat your body so you're gonna really hot.
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Yes.
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Because it requires a lot of oxygen.
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It pulls a lot of oxygen to break those carbohydrates and starches down.
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And during that oxidation process, you have increased body heat, right?
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You don't have nearly that body heat increase from using higher levels of fat.
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Okay?
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But that's, not the commercial industry uses vitamin C.
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So they'll add one, they'll add between one and two pounds of ascorbic acid by, technical name for vitamin C.
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Right?
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People could consider like we, we've told people about the the homemade electrolyte mix, and you could actually add some lemon juice to that.
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Or some vitamin C and even kick that up a notch as far as relieving heat stress, as it is, it does a nice job of relieving heat stress, but if you wanted to take it to the next level, adding some natural vitamin C to that mix, it is gonna get you even further.
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Yeah.
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But yeah, commercial industry manages heat stress by adding vitamin C plus they have, all their barns have big fans in'em.
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They're moving air constantly.
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Oh yeah, they're huge fans.
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Huge.
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Yeah.
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And
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so we have a question here.
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Okay.
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Cassie wants to know, what suggestion do we have to beat the heat when your birds are stuck at a fair or any other poultry show for that matter?
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Not a whole lot you're gonna do other than, like I said if you did the homemade electrolyte mix or you buy it, but.
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And adding some vitamin C to that mix, so that base mix is two ounces of vinegar, apple cider vinegar, one ounce molasses, one tablespoon in grated ginger, A teaspoon of salt, and.
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Like a quarter teaspoon of Tabasco sauce.
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The reason for the Tabasco sauce folks, is it dilates tissue in the digestive tract, which allows for faster absorption.
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Okay?
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We're not trying to make Mexican chickens.
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That's not the purpose here.
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So it's, it actually has a scientific purpose for the mix being in the mix.
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Now, to that mix, you could add two ounces of lemon juice.
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Or,
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some type of vitamin C delivery.
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Squeeze
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the orange.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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And It helps with the flavor.
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The birds are gonna appreciate it,
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and
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it's going to take you up a notch on that heat stress management.
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For sure.
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And I'll also add one thing that I have done when transporting birds, which should also be done at a show.
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We have, everybody knows that we have toddlers.
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And at one point a couple years ago, we went, took'em, took some of the kids to Disney World and we got a battery powered fan to clip onto a stroller.
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And over the years, transporting chickens in the summertime, like in an enclosed trailer.
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I have used that battery powered fan to help cool the birds.
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So if you got some that are stuck, just stick the fan out there by'em.
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I'm sure the birds next to'em will appreciate it too.
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Yeah battery operated fan are a rechargeable, battery operated fan.
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Definitely is a good option.
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You see a lot of those people carrying'em in hotter places, so it's yeah.
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Also the ones that are battery powered that have the squirt bottles on them, you could hit a bird with that every now and then.
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That would help out too, while you're at a fair.
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So what are some ways that we could, let's say you're hot too.
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'cause it feels like it's 110 outside.
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What's some ways that you could go out there quickly, check on your birds during the day and know, Hey, we got a problem.
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We've got heat stress, like they're showing signs.
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We need to do something.
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What are some things that you can look at and see on your birds to know real quick that there's a problem?
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You already mentioned it, but they're gonna have their wings flared.
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They're gonna have their wings lifted, allowing more, airflow under the wing where there's a lot of trapped heat and those are the early signs.
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And then you're actually gonna see open mouth breathing, like panting going on and by the time you get to panting, I start to worry because now they're respirating out more moisture.
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By breathing through their open beak and breathing through their nostrils, right?
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So they're transpiring more moisture, it's being expelled out through the lung and we just gotta make sure, working across many different genres of poultry keepers.
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I honestly will tell you the number one mistake I see.
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Is people put their sun, put their drinking or their drinkers in direct sunlight, and that is the number one mistake.
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Chickens are not sun worshipers.
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And I've watched a lot of chickens die because.
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They would rather sit in the shade and not drink than have to go out into direct sunlight, between 10 and three in the afternoon.
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They, they will avoid going out there to drink that water.
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Plus the water's really hot being in that direct sunlight.
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So yeah, just not a good combination.
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A couple years ago I had suggested to Carol Wilson down in Odessa, Texas to get some cheap, 20 co coolers, 24 foot cooler, whatever, cheap, cooler and plumb those up to run gravity flow to her drinkers.
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And in there, then she could freeze like one gallon, blocks of ice.
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Fill that up with water and fill that up with water and could be serving cold water all day right through, whether it's a small nipple line or something like that.
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So what I started doing is I take, I'll go to a show and I'll see the half gallon water cups.
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That they have for the cages, the cage cups that are like ginormous.
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If you take those and put, all the way, but about an inch worth of water in them, put that in your deep freeze in the afternoon, they'll freeze overnight.
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Yep.
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And I, everybody knows that I have a lot of automatic waters that use a five gallon bucket as a reservoir.
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I put three or four of those in the bucket and it cools down everything that's in the line.
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Those huge chunks of ice will last several hours, even in hot water.
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So that, I know it's not ice water, but it's a lot better.
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And one of the things that I wanted to ask you about, because I've seen this in several groups, is a lot of people when they do see their birds panting or they see watery droppings, they panic.
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Then they want to go get ice water and give it to the chickens.
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Personally I wondered if that would not cause'em to go in shock.
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So I wanted to ask you about your opinion and how you felt on that.
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They're not gonna go into shock, but they're not gonna drink as much of that as we want them to.
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Okay.
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So really cold water like below, say 50 degrees they're going to avoid drinking that.
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Just as much as they're going to avoid drinking water that's over a hundred degrees.
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'cause it's been in the sunlight.
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And
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so if we can keep water like 65 to 85 degrees.
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They're gonna drink that.
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Okay.
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'cause it's still way lower than their body temperature.
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Yeah.
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I see a lot of waterers out there.
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I see a lot of drinkers.
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And if you went out and did a temperature check at three o'clock in the afternoon in some climates right it's gonna be well over a hundred degrees.
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And, yeah.
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The bird only drinks it because it needs to, not really because it likes it.
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So figuring out a way to serve some cool cooler water particularly during the peak heat, like from noon to four is gonna be pretty critical.
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I don't know how everybody does that.
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I'm, I don't have a system in my mind that's gonna work for everybody.
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Like I had suggested to you earlier today and yesterday is.
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If I had a circulation system where the water was always moving, one that encourages, everybody knows the chicken likes to go chase water and why they do that, I don't know, but they like moving water.
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So if you could have a recirculation system, you could actually have that come back to one single large reservoir that is on a float.
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That's automatically getting filled.
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You can pump it with a pond pump or something like that.
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Low voltage doesn't take a lot.
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But keeping that moving now you could put a larger chunk of ice in that reservoir to keep that water, at a really nice temperature.
00:17:49.932 --> 00:18:19.412
And it sounds like a lot of work and people, I can see their eyes rolling back in their head, but I've seen this working with a little bit of thought, just a recirculation system, especially if your pens are all lined up in a straight row, or if your birds are all in one group, working on a circulating system of water, they for sure drink more water, that's, and the more water I can get into'em through this upcoming, next month is gonna be really important.
00:18:20.311 --> 00:18:28.672
And not only that, when you're raising, when you hatch out chicks, them drinking a lot of water as a chick is also very important.
00:18:29.092 --> 00:18:32.832
So something like that wouldn't just benefit in the summertime.
00:18:32.892 --> 00:18:33.471
It would benefit
00:18:34.372 --> 00:18:34.711
Oh yeah.
00:18:34.821 --> 00:18:35.112
Year
00:18:35.112 --> 00:18:35.392
round.
00:18:35.392 --> 00:18:36.551
Because in the wintertime.
00:18:37.451 --> 00:18:42.412
Running water is not gonna be as acceptable to freezing Yep.
00:18:42.832 --> 00:18:44.582
As still water.
00:18:44.912 --> 00:18:47.642
Which is, the twofold behind my thought process.
00:18:48.021 --> 00:18:59.201
What I was originally thinking is using some gutters and put gutters in the pens, like a foot section or whatever, and then using a flexible hose to connect them.
00:19:00.102 --> 00:19:11.231
And, just have a pump pushing water to them all the time and pulling it back into a 30 gallon drum and circulating that way.
00:19:12.132 --> 00:19:14.592
But I'm gonna try it on a smaller scale.